Lost, and found,
in translation

Tēnā whakaāhua mai ō mahi hei mātai-ako kei tō tātou whare taonga?

Kua matapaki tahi māua ko tōku rangatira a Matthew Crumpton. Ko tō māua kitenga, e maha ngā hōtaka pūtaiao i kōnei i roto i te reo Pākehā, engari he nui ngā mātauranga Māori e hāngai ana ki te ao pūtaiao. Nā reira i whakarite māua me tukuna atu i ētahi hōtaka pūtaiao ki ngā kura reo Māori. Ehara i te mea ko ngā kaupapa ahurea Māori ngā kaupapa anake e ako ana ngā kura Māori, ko te Ao katoa kē o tātou Ao. Kua tīmata au ki te hoahoatia ngā hōtaka e pā ana ki ngā moko tuauri me ngā ngarara. Kua eke mai a TKKM o Hoani Waititi, TKKM o te Rakipaewhenua me te wāhanga rūmaki o Randwick Park School ki te aromatawai i te kounga o aua hōtaka, ā i naianei e tūwhera ana kia tonoa ai e ngā kura reo Māori ki runga ki tō mātou paetukutuku. E kōtuitui ana ēnei hōtaka i ngā mātauranga o ō tātou tupuna ki ngā mātauranga kua tuhura mai i te Ao whānui. 

Could you describe your role and your mahi in the Education team?  

I am a learning specialist in our mātauranga Māori programmes. Most days I am delivering programmes that tell us about aspects of Te Ao Māori, such as our art and architecture, our celebrations and the worldviews that lie behind them, and how we came to discover Aotearoa and the unique knowledge we brought with us from the Pacific.

Over the summer, I started to look at some of the mainstream science programmes we deliver and to translate these programmes into not just te reo Māori, but also to be underpinned by Māori approaches to knowledge. There is so much that mātauranga Māori can teach popular science, and we wanted to start inviting Māori language learners into these programmes more and develop their voices.

Ko te whāinga mātua kia tūwhera ai ēnei mātauranga pūtaiao ki ngā ākonga Māori, ko te painga atu rānei kia whanake ai ngā hōtaka auraki kia maiaho mai ngā ākonga katoa i ngā mātauranga Māori?

Ko tōku tino aronga ko ngā ākonga Māori. He hiahia hoki nā ngā mātai-ako auraki kia whai tika ai ō rātou hōtaka pūtaiao i ngā mātauranga Māori, ā ka tautoko au i a rātou ki te whakauru i ētahi tirohanga Māori ki ngā hōtaka auraki. Otirā, ko tōku aronga ko ngā ākonga Māori. E hia kē ngā paenga e tūwhera ana ki ngā kura auraki. Ko tōku kōranga kia ahuahu mai i ngā rauemi ako kounga mā ngā ākonga Māori. Kei roto i ngā hōtaka Māori ngā mātauranga pūtaiao katoa nō ngā hōtaka auraki, engari he makuru anō ngā hōtaka Māori, nā te mea ko tō tātou mātauranga taketake te pūtake. 

I tēnei tau kei te whakawhanake māua ko taku tino hoa mahi a Gabriel Tongaāwhikau - he mātai ako hoki ia – i ētahi hōtaka  hou e pā ana ki ētahi kaupapa anō, ā ka tukuna atu ki te reo Māori, me te reo Pākehā hoki. A tōna wā ko tō māua hiahia te tukuna atu i ētahi hōtaka i roto i te reo Māori anake. Engari me pā mai ngā kura Māori a te tuatahi, me kitea ngā kaiwhakahaere i te hiahia o te marea Māori kia tautoko ai rātou i ngā hōtaka Māori motuhake.

Is the objective to improve access for Māori language learners, or is there also an opportunity for the mainstream programmes to be influenced by mātauranga Māori? 

The new programmes for Kura Kaupapa and other Māori language schools offer everything that exists in English versions of those programmes, but they incorporate other mātauranga and ways of looking at things, too. That's where we started. A little later this year, we are intending to design some programmes that are uniquely for Māori language learners. They will be looking at our wider world, specifically through a Māori lens.

These programmes would be just as good for English language learners, but it's important to me to prioritise te reo Māori because for so long English has been prioritised, even though te reo Māori is the first language of this country and a lot more people are learning it now. I want to contribute to giving learning and supporting te reo that extra incentive. 

He mahi toi ōu, nē? He ringawaituhi koe, atu i ō mahi ki te kōnei. Ka ahu mai ō rautaki whakaako i ō auahatanga toi?

Ka tāea te kī pea, he mōwhiti ngā whakaaro toi e mau ana tō tinana katoa. Arā, ka titiro au ki tētahi mātū tāwhito pēnā i ngā taonga e tiakina ana i roto i tēnei whare, kei te pohewa kētia tōku tinana ka pēhea te whakamahinga o tēnei taonga, tēnei mātū. He aha ngā tūkanga ka wheakohia e te tangata i a ia tēnei taonga e whakamahi ana? He aha ngā rapanga ka puta i tōna whakamahinga? He aha ngā uarā, ngā matāpono e mārama ana te tangata nā āna mahi ki tēnei mātū? Ki te maahi tētahi hapori katoa i tētahi mātū pēnei, he aha te hononga o taua tukanga, ki ō rātou tirohanga Ao?

Ka mau te wēhi hoki ahau ki ngā taonga tāwhito katoa. Ahakoa ngā pūrākau me ngā māramatanga e pā ana ki taua tāonga, kei reira tonu te pātai ‘He aha i ahu pērā ai?’, ‘He pēhea ki roto i ō rātou hinengaro.’ Ka mīharo tonu au.  He tino kōranga nōku ki te mārama ki aua tangata nō te Ao ki mua rā. He Ao anō tērā. 

You are also an artist – a painter – outside this role. Does your art practice influence how you teach? 

Well, I have worked as an artist for many, many more years than I have been teaching – though that feels like a long time too now! But because I look at my world from that side, I appreciate materials a lot in terms of what it would be like to work with them. 

When I'm looking at an object, my mind is always considering what would have gone into becoming the way it was, or imagining what it would be like to use: what processes it would entail, what problems would it pose, and what types of solutions would evolve from that situation. I'm paying attention to what objects can tell me about not only the social and practical interactions of people, but also the types of philosophical values that would arise from using them, is always quite present in my mind. 

I suppose this approach also just fills me with a sense of awe and mystery. Even when there is a lot of kōrero around a particular taonga, I still wonder to think, 'Why did they make it like THAT?! How exactly did they perceive the world to make something like that?’

Kua hangaia e koe ētahi kāri tākaro e whakaatu ana ngā moko tuauri. Ko te mea tuatahi ngā waituhi, ko te hōtaka ako rānei?

I waituhi ahau i ēnei moko tuauri hei rauemi whakakīnaki ki te hōtaka ‘Nō te Ao Kōhatu: Ngā Moko Tuauri’.  

Heoī anō, tēku tau ki mua ko āku mahi toi he peita hinu e whakaatu i ngā moko tuauri. Nā reira, kua whai wāhi nui ahau ki mua ki te whakaharatau KTK. 

You have created a series of flash cards featuring prehistoric creatures and translated their names into Māori. What inspired you to make these cards? Which came first, the paintings or the programme? 

Matthew Crumpton (Learning Manager) had encouraged me to figure out how to offer more of our science programmes in Māori contexts, and to make some resources to go along with them. I always think that something that is unique is more attractive, so I did the painting. So, it was the programme first, but in saying that, I used to paint large paintings of dinosaurs in oil paint about ten years ago as part of my art practice, so in that way, the painting came first, but it has now found itself a new context. 

Kāore anō ētahi tūmomo mokonui kia tapaina kē i te reo Māori. Kua pēhea koe i tapaina i aua moko tuauri ingoa-kore i roto i te reo Māori?

Ki te kōrero pono, he wero! Kua tae āhua toru mīriona tau tūreiti ō tātou tupuna ki te tūtaki ki ngā mokonui i ora ai i kōnei. Nā reira i kore ō rātou kupu kōrero e pā ana ki ngā moko tuauri. I kore i mōhiotia te tangata i kōnei ai ngā mokonui tae noa atu ki ngā tau whitu! Nā, i taua wā kua tāmihia katoatia ō tātou reo. 

Kua rapu ahau i ētahi ingoa mai i ngā papakupu hou, engari mō ētahi, kua wānanga ahau ki āku hoa. E waimarie ana au i te nui o āku hoa reo Māori, e mau mai ana i ō rātou ake mātauranga ahurei. Ko Ma’ara Maeva tētahi. He reo Kuki Airini tōna. Nā reira ahakoa he reo Māori, kei reira taua hononga ki ngā tupuna reo o te Moana Nui ā-Kiwa. He nui ōna mōhioranga hoki e pā ana ngā reo whānui o te taua Moana. Ka toha māramatanga mai ia o ngā pūtake o tō tātou reo. He āwhina tēnā. 

E hono ana au ki ētahi nerdpages hoki ki a pukamata. Ko ‘Te Mana o te Reo Māori’ tētahi. I reira whakaīria ai tētahi i tāna pātai reo, ka karawhiua ai te marea reo Māori whānui ki te wānanga, ki te tautohe, ki te waihanga hatakēhi hoki i ō tātou reo.   He rawe tēnā, ki au nei, ko te reo ora tēnā. 

Can you describe how you translated to creatures’ names?  

My scope isn’t limited to just the dinosaurs! I was – and still am – also developing our insects and volcanoes programmes. We have some very different ways of categorising things in te reo, as well as a lot of reo that has simply been lost due to the way our language was engineered out of everyday use by so many educational and legal policies. And with dinosaurs, well, our tupuna didn’t cross paths with them time-wise, in Aotearoa!

In the end, I found quite a few words from 'Wakareo’ that was once under the care of Te Taura Whiri. For some other words, I had casual wānanga with other te reo speakers, and with my colleague Ma'ara Maeva, whose Māori extends back to the Pacific. He was able to shed light on older meanings of some Māori words with their origins in language. I also belong to an amazing Facebook community where Māori speakers are always making posts, asking for a wānanga about some aspect or another of te reo.

With the name for the Plesiosaur, I was stumped. In the end, I could only find a specific Plesiosaur that had been called 'Kaiwhekea'. I was pretty sure that was given to it as a proper name, but since I had nothing else, and it had such a cool ring to it, I have used it for the Plesiosaur as a general species here. 

Te reo Māori is, like all spoken languages, still evolving through adapting to new knowledge, and, as it is being taken up again by our younger generations, it is evolving even more fluidly as they use it to articulate their everyday experiences and thoughts.

He aha te hiranga o ngā kupu kua tapaina e koe ki ngā moko tuauri?

Ehara ko ngā kupu te mea hiranga, ka tere ngaro pea aua kupu, engari mō nainei hei tautohu noa aua kupu i tēnā tūmomo, i tēnā tūmomo, kia haere tonu ai te kōrero. He nui ngā māramatanga e ahu mai ana i te horopaki, mō ngā tangata kōrero Māori. Tēnā pea ka tautohu tētahi i te mea kōtahi me tētahi kupu anō, engari ko te mea nui kei te whakamahia ngā kupu mārama o tō tātou reo ki te whakaāhua i tō tātou ao. 

Ko te mea nui ki au, ko te whao māramatanga mā ngā kupu rere. Engari e hia kē ngā rautaki whao whakaaro e tāea e tātou. 

How do you think learning these kupu will change how your students learn? 

I don't think all the kupu I have used in these kaupapa are particularly important – if they describe something well enough then its meaning comes through. And it’s not so much about making up words – it’s the picture it puts in your mind. 

I think speaking Māori, you understand a lot from context, and so somebody might come up with other kupu/words for things. There is also a larger project going on with Ngāti Kurī, where they are working with another group from here on reo Māori identifying names for the insects, so that will be a hugely valuable resource. 

It's the immediate transfer of knowledge and ideas that is important to me, and the way people put things together, of their own choosing. That's what makes all language fun and colourful.